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A ton of new Tom Rowlands/Chemical Brothers titles registered at SACEM

Started by Ben_j, Mar 09, 2018, 10:56

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I have no doubt about clearance checks, but the result may just be: this can be used without any further actions or requirements .

Quote from: Bosco on Apr 24, 2021, 22:11

but then again like Wolkenkrabber has said, she wasn't the writer or owner of the lyrics even though she sung them. So is there legal grounds for crediting a vocalist? I have no clue.

I think your right! Take the Grammy awards for an example: The song of the year nominee. The winner of this award goes to the actual songwriter, not the singer or performer

Quote from: Stefan on Apr 25, 2021, 21:15

I have no doubt about clearance checks, but the result may just be: this can be used without any further actions or requirements .

and Caroline Ellis (in a technical sense) didnt need to know, because this is the music business BUT

Quote from: Bosco on Apr 24, 2021, 22:11

When I saw these tweets about spelling out the sample sources, I nearly thought this might be a response from HQ to our shenanigans.  ::)

Bosco, you and the rest of you forumites did a good thing. You brought out someone who was in obscurity for a long time and mentioined her while bringing her back to somewhat a relevant yet perfect timing in this day of age.( I think she just opened a twitter account because of this.)

I honestly think that the Chems and Caroline can wash this over behind the scenes. But would be cool if the Chems can make an exception to provide the credit.
This is up there. Like, Star Guitar up there.

Weren't we speculating that they had recreated the sample? A la WGTT?

I know the tweet from the Brothers (HQ) mentions the Bugaloos as a direct sample, but if they did recreate it, AND it's not written by her, then there's even less reason to inform her. They didn't tell Diane Di Prima either. And likely because in both cases it's the record label that they're (the Chems' record label) dealing with for the performance rights. It wouldn't surprise me if a lot of artists from that era really have no say what is done with their recorded work. And opening a dialogue with, in this case, someone who shouldn't legally be involved in the discussion, just adds extra headaches to all involved.

Interesting though. My wife has been asking me how the Bugaloos feel about their work becoming so integral to a CB tune and I didn't really have an answer until now! We were discussing the morality of recreating samples too - particularly faithful, almost indiscernible, recreations. It's definitely a murky lake to wade through.
dancesoitallkeepsspinning

Quote from: Stefan on Apr 25, 2021, 20:56

I don't think this is relevant here, but I recently read this twitter thread about Taylor Swifts music and IP laws, and this stuff is weeeird:
https://twitter.com/ThatsMauvelous/status/1380572708879089674

That is a wild story.

Quote from: Stefan on Apr 25, 2021, 21:15

I have no doubt about clearance checks, but the result may just be: this can be used without any further actions or requirements .

I'm pretty sure this is the case. Agreed.

That being said, again, I'm sympathetic to Caroline Ellis. Assuming that her Twitter account is authentic, I would imagine it being quite shocking hearing your 50 year old recorded voice getting recycled into a song for today, and then also used for the opening/outro to a major promotional event for a company like Apple. Not being notified until after-the-fact, is pretty cold hearted.

Quote from: Enjoyed on Apr 25, 2021, 23:34

Interesting though. My wife has been asking me how the Bugaloos feel about their work becoming so integral to a CB tune and I didn't really have an answer until now! We were discussing the morality of recreating samples too - particularly faithful, almost indiscernible, recreations. It's definitely a murky lake to wade through.
Maybe I'm in a cold-hearted mood, but the Bugaloos were a TV Show band. If the Chems had sampled the Muppets singing something, should the muppet singers seek any special acknowledgement? Or if they sampled dialogue from Magnum PI (and paid the TV company), should Tom Selleck seek a credit?

Having said that, I suspect the reason for those Chemical tweets was nothing to do with us. We had the answers before the track came out! I suspect it was a way of "crediting" Ms Ellis. - Being polite (having clearly seen her tweet).

Also re the Soul Brothers Six sample, at first I said it was a direct sample, then I changed my mind and said it's been re-recorded. But following the Chems tweets which also went on their Facebook, a random fan on the Chems facebook page replied to me to suggest (i.e. guess) it is a direct sample that's been pitched up. And that's what I'm currently leaning towards FWIW.

As for re-recording/interpolation. Well, you're just doing a (bit of) a cover version. If you're paying the royaties I don't see a problem with that. I don't have a problem with Shinichi Osawa doing Star Guitar for example. The Chems liked it so much, he did DJ support for them on their last Japanese tour!

PS Stars On 45 were re-creating Beatles songs (amazingly well) for their disco-mix medley album (and singles) as far back as 1981.

PPS...
Quote from: Enjoyed on Apr 25, 2021, 23:34

Weren't we speculating that they had recreated the sample? A la WGTT?

I know the tweet from the Brothers (HQ) mentions the Bugaloos as a direct sample, but if they did recreate it, ...
Caroline says in her one and only tweet that it is her.
Last Edit: Apr 26, 2021, 11:34 by Wolkenkrabber
IT'S MORNING TIME!

I don't know whether it was there all along but they give full credits in the description below their video.

Quote
Vocal samples: Caroline Ellis on The Bugaloos' "The Senses Of Our World" (1970) & John Ellison on "I'll Be Loving You" by Soul Brothers Six (1967)
"You cannot eat money, oh no. You cannot eat money, oh no. When the last tree has fallen and the rivers are poisoned, you cannot eat money, oh no."
— Aurora (The Seed)

There's one called "Slow Butt Grind" credited to Tom & Ed  :D

EBW9 is listed as "The Wizard Rush"

There is also one named "Problems" (problem/question?)




Its hard to find the unclear between the already released because a lot of the released stuff had weird or at least wrong names which slightly differ to the real names.
no idea, no idea

Quote from: ThePumisher on Sep 04, 2021, 18:38

There's one called "Slow Butt Grind" credited to Tom & Ed  :D

EBW9 is listed as "The Wizard Rush"

There is also one named "Problems" (problem/question?)




Its hard to find the unclear between the already released because a lot of the released stuff had weird or at least wrong names which slightly differ to the real names.

Wasn't Slow Butt Grind attributed to the ending of Elektrobank?
And I feel like I'm dreaming...and I feel like I'm dreaming...

Quote from: hstn on Sep 05, 2021, 04:06

Wasn't Slow Butt Grind attributed to the ending of Elektrobank?

It might be, as for example the outro beats of The Prodigy's Narayan are in fact the separate live jam track called Firedrill
Where do I start?
Where do I begin?

Quote from: JRSZ on Sep 05, 2021, 04:12

It might be, as for example the outro beats of The Prodigy's Narayan are in fact the separate live jam track called Firedrill

From Tim's Twitter Listening Party back in April
And I feel like I'm dreaming...and I feel like I'm dreaming...

Quote from: hstn on Sep 05, 2021, 11:01

From Tim's Twitter Listening Party back in April


It always sound like the recording of armageddon for me B)

Also, I completely forgot about this, must have missed it, or dunno, as I attented thsle listening party

Where do I start?
Where do I begin?

Couple of new songs registered (I think.) Can someone research the names and maybe put the pieces together?

Something new in the works with Tim Burgess? Diamond Dave (David Lee Roth), what???

Also, the number I remember searching was greater before it was closer to 250 results, now condensed to 222 searching, "Thomas Rowlands".

Quote from: Bosco on Apr 19, 2022, 20:10

Couple of new songs registered (I think.) Can someone research the names and maybe put the pieces together?
A lackey to do the donkey work? Surely you don't want us to steal your thunder on this Bosco?!


Quote from: Bosco on Apr 19, 2022, 20:10

Also, the number I remember searching was greater before it was closer to 250 results, now condensed to 222 searching, "Thomas Rowlands".
Hmm weird, let us know if you figure it out.

Must say I wish I'd logged in before reading your post. Didn't see your screenshots at first.
Isn't DLR the guy who once sent the Chems a video of him syncing along to one of their songs?
click. or click2
Have they actually done something with him for real? :o It's not even a Tom-only type deal which might suggest Tom worked on a new track for a Diamond Dave album. It lists Ed too whch suggests it's an official Chems track (!). We've already had April 1st right?

As for the Tim Burgess "Why D You Lie" entry, the other songwriters listed are clearly the members of Full Force. Suggests a sample of one of their own tracks or something they wrote/produced for another artist. ( I bought a Lisa Lisa & Cult Jam 12" once upon a time...)
I'm a little surprised to see Tim involved for a third time. With the last album it felt like a deliberate move away from the old guests and a bid for some new blood with Aurora...

I wonder if these could be old songs newly registered?..
IT'S MORNING TIME!

Quote from: Wolkenkrabber on Apr 19, 2022, 21:33

Isn't DLR the guy who once sent the Chems a video of him syncing along to one of their songs?
click. or click2
Have they actually done something with him for real? :o It's not even a Tom-only type deal which might suggest Tom worked on a new track for a Diamond Dave album. It lists Ed too whch suggests it's an official Chems track (!).

Behind your first click it says the songs are his cover versions [...] and the Chemical Brothers' "Dig Your Own Hole," which he calls "'How About A Little Fire' Scarecrow?". In Boscos first screenshot the registered song is titled as Scarecrow. And because the internet doesn't forget theres a video of that song in very poor quality so no one is able to hear DYOH in it...

no idea, no idea

Man, a David Lee Roth collab would be totally unexpected, potentially disastrous, and so incredibly fun. Kinda bummed it seems to be for the this Scarecrow track from this rare "No Holds Bar-B-Que" tape. Why this is showing up now, is a bit of a mystery. Maybe this is getting re-released? Would still like to hear it in better quality.


As for "Why'd You Lie", this seems like the track potentially in question:

Spoiler

Produced by Full Force crew, and the mystery ladies listed, Nyanda & Nailah Thorbourne, are 'Brick & Lace'

I'm not hearing a whole lot that would inspire Tom and Ed borrow from this track. The chorus, maybe interpolated?


Edit: It just came to me that the chorus in the Brick & Lace, is sang in the way of Simon and Garfunkel's "The Boxer". So either this one large coincidence being Tim Burgess sang in The Boxer for Chemical Brothers, or some deep level cross reference fail.
Last Edit: Apr 20, 2022, 02:25 by Bosco

Is the chorus the bit from 1:01 to 1:14? Cos if it is, then the chorus is a straight steal from Simon & Garfunkle's The Boxer.
Ohhhh The Boxer!! They've credited the wrong Boxer!!! HaHaHa!!!! :))

They've credited the Tim Burgess/Chems Boxer on SACEM instead of crediting Paul Simon. I think this is a false alarm. A F**k up by SACEM.



PS David Lee Roth announced his retirement a couple of years ago. Don't hold your breath on that one either.




IT'S MORNING TIME!


So there was a rumor floating about last year that Tom was working with director Joe Wright ('Hanna', 'Darkest Hour', and just about every Keira Knightley film)... and apparently it's coming true:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/joe-wright-luca-marinelli-mussolini-tv-m-son-of-the-century-1235373399/

Quote
While the screenwriters worked on finding the right tone, Wright worked on the rhythm. On set, he says, he puts on music to "re-create the atmosphere of the scene we're about to shoot."

Reportedly, the soundtrack for M. Son of the Century will be composed by legendary English electronic music duo The Chemical Brothers, ensuring M. will not be your grandfather's period drama.

"We wanted to show the grotesque side of this tragedy", says co-writer Serino. "We didn't want to get on our soapbox with this series. Its tone will probably surprise you."

How exciting!!  :o I can't wait to hear what comes of this!
Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.

Quote from: Bosco on Mar 28, 2024, 21:23
So there was a rumor floating about last year that Tom was working with director Joe Wright ('Hanna', 'Darkest Hour', and just about every Keira Knightley film)...

I was going to say, Bosco your Google alert has been doing the business this week, producing the Aurora news and this little nugget. But then I realised that the Hollywood Reporter article is dated April of last year. So the news is almost a year old. I think the first we were aware of it here on the forum was when @whitelabel84 mentioned an interview with Ed here about six weeks ago. So I guess we've all slept on this one. Still, we did have a proper Chems album to look forward to last year, so perhaps we can forgive ourselves.

Quote from: Bosco on Mar 28, 2024, 21:23
...director Joe Wright ('Hanna', 'Darkest Hour', and just about every Keira Knightley film)...
Don't forget 2017's Life Of Galileo at The Young Vic theatre which Joe and Tom collaborated on. I wonder if any of that music score might reappear here. After all, it is unreleased. I'll be keeping my ears 'peeled' for anything familiar (but I'd bet against Papal Disco).
An 8 part series offers the potential for at least as much music as Hanna gave us, doesn't it? But perhaps less chance of a release. So someone clever is perhaps going to be trying to rip and isolate this score - I hope!

PS snippets of that 'Galileo' audio are still available to listen to, playing underneath an interview with Joe and Tom on the BBC website here from around 20 mins.

oh also
Quote
the soundtrack for M. Son of the Century will be composed by legendary English electronic music duo The Chemical Brothers

So people are starting to use "legendary" to describe The Chems, and the latest album didn't sell well . Perhaps they really are now entering their 'legacy' years. Full retro-album tours up next?

:ducks for cover:



oh EDIT. There's a Variety article about the series. This is also from last April. Scroll down to the bit where Joe Wright took questions from the international press.

Quote
Talk to us about the tone, the aesthetics of "M"

You can play with the aesthetics and the form of the piece. The score is going to be this kind of techno score. And the aesthetics are a kind of mashup between nineties rave culture and "Man with a Movie Camera" [the 1929 seminal avant-guarde doc by Dziga Vertov] a great Ukrainian film. It's "Man with a Movie Camera" and every gangster movie you've ever seen. So it's quite full on in that respect. And it's quite kaleidoscopic.

Speaking about the soundtrack, are the Chemical Brothers in?

I don't know yet, but I don't think I'm supposed to talk about that.

Do you play techno music on set while you're shooting?

Yeah, quite a lot. I play all sorts of music on set, not just techno. If we are doing a sad scene, I might play some sad music. We have a Friday morning sing-along, which is often Elton John. If I've got a big crowd with a lot of men, who are supposed to be full of testosterone and energy, then I might play techno, or I might play Black Sabbath. But yeah, music is very much an integral part of the process for me. And it's all about rhythm and getting people into the right rhythm, and music can help with that. Also it's a good way of communicating to the kind of periphery of the set, by which I mean craft services or whoever, that this is the atmosphere of the scene today. So they can feel the right energy. And also sometimes it's four o'clock in the morning and everyone's just battered.

So if you put on some Chemical Brothers or whoever, then it keeps the energy alive as well. I want people to have a good time on my set. I don't want people to feel miserable. We spend our lives doing this and certainly we spent six months shooting this. I want people to look back on this experience as an exciting and fulfilling and happy one. The process is as important as the product. And so that process better be rewarding. Otherwise, I don't just want to end up as a DVD on the shelf and they say: "Oh, that was good. It's got to be a living life thing."
Last Edit: Mar 30, 2024, 16:05 by Wolkenkrabber
IT'S MORNING TIME!

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