Movies/Shows you're watching.

[satur8]

American Gods is excellent!

We have it queued up on the DVR but want a few episodes to build before we dive in. Although I'm familiar with some of Gaiman's work (including his clever children's books), I am going into American God blindly.

And now for something completely different...

Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 was so much fun.

[Wolkenkrabber]

EDIT: Chems remixer Paul Woolford/Special Request involved in sound design. Of the trailer. Not clear if that includes the film.

https://twitter.com/PaulWoolford/status/862238698758340608

[Bosco]

Im not sure if I should comment on the trailer, because there's only one person's opinion on this forum that counts regarding anything 'Blade Runner' 


needs more haze

[whirlygirl]

I don't know why there's a new Blade Runner. The first one was perfection to me. Making a new one is like going on stage after Elvis, The Beatles, or The Chemical Brothers.

The trailers don't look bad (and I do like the director) but... hmmm... I will probably see it but it will be extremely difficult not to go in with my bias towards the original.

[sandelic]

Just watched Alien covenant, cantvwait to hear what you guys/girls think

[Born In Planet Dust]

Mindfuck courtesy of David Lynch coming in 1 hour and 45 minutes. 

[Born In Planet Dust]

Mindfuck courtesy of David Lynch coming in 1 hour and 45 minutes. 

3 episodes in.

WOW BOB WOW

[MadPooter]

**ALIEN: COVENANT SPOILERS AHEAD**

I ended up seeing Alien: Covenant twice over the weekend. I think I liked it a lot, despite its failures.

Before I say anything else, though, I have to say this: This is unequivocally the third best film in the Alien franchise.

Moving on. I'll start with the bad.

As a horror movie, it's not extremely compelling. It tries to ride the line between Horror/Sci-Fi/Action, and it doesn't do a good job of it. I would say at best it truly succeeds in being a Sci-Fi/existential bender.

The dialogue ranges from being absolutely compelling to awful one-liners. I can only think that they tried to have something for everybody, and in the process risked alienating anybody. Larger discussions are missed, and eye-rolling moments ensue for those looking for something more. There's a certain cohesion and balance lacking in the plot, and it felt uneven.

There was at least one moment of plot that absolutely did not work for me--how the fuck did another alien get on the ship at the end? Did I miss something? There was this whole scene where one of the crew wrestles with a facehugger, gets some acid on his face, but then somehow becomes "impregnated" by an alien even though the facehugger doesn't successfully attach with him.

I suppose we're left to understand that the crew member becomes "impregnated" somehow by the acid seeping into his body, kind of like the parasites invading other crew members' bodies through their open cavities. This is a stretch, and this is coming from someone who *wants* to allow himself to love any Alien film that comes along.

Lastly, I miss having 100% practical effects for special effects. The lighting and rendering on CGI these days *looks* very pretty and pretty real, but the problem is that it ends up becoming hyperreal. My mind has to adjust and it doesn't feel "natural." Whatever that means.

Now for the good.

This film actually managed to make its predecessor better. At the end of Prometheus, everyone was left with questions. There was such an extraordinary amount of questions in Prometheus that were left unanswered that I think it ended up leaving everyone unsatisfied.

Alien: Covenant answered a number of those questions, and it left me feeling satisfied. Like a bit of closure, I suppose, on my previous viewing experiences of Prometheus. And one of those questions was central to the story, and managed to tie in a theme that is sustained throughout the entire franchise.

The question: Is David really evil?

And the answer is: Yes. Oh God yes. In every way, yes. In fact, he's probably the most evil fucking thing in existence.

The problem with Prometheus was that whenever anyone did *anything*, there was *no* foundation given for whatever it was that they were doing. Every single character in the film, with the exception of David, appeared to have no motivation for doing anything that they were doing.

What I mean by that is that there were characters in Prometheus who stood on screen and kind of talked "at" you rather than with each other, and the conversations in the film ended up not really allowing for any true understanding of why anyone was doing anything. You never had a moment where any of the characters clicked for you and you were either A. Rooting for them to live; or B. Waiting for them to die because they deserved it.

So no one was able to relate to anyone in the film. Except for David.

David was properly given context--there was evident tension in his creation and you could tell that he had motivations that he could not truly express. The evidence being his introduction of that black, viscous liquid into a crew-member's drink. Naturally, you ended up asking, "Why?" And that question became even more confusing when it appeared that he was helping other crew members at times. What were his goals? Why did he do this? Who was he serving?

So Alien: Covenant answered these questions. And it's because David is pure fucking evil. And it becomes an amazing part of the Alien lore.

The genesis of the Alien was the result of humankind's creation tinkering with humandkind's creator's method of controlling creation. And it's terrifyingly beautiful.

Its beauty lies in the mounds of existential questions implicitly raised by this narrative, and also how this narrative now strengthens the links to other Alien films--the "good vs. evil" in the androids, and the recurrence of evil in androids in the films.

One moment that stands out in particular is in the original Alien where the remaining crew members are having a conversation with the android Ash. Ash has been disabled, mostly, with the exception of his head. As the crew is having a conversation with Ash, the crew realizes that Ash is under orders from the company, and also one very important detail: Ash has a distinct opinion about the xenomorph.

You get to know exactly what Ash thinks about the creature when they ask how they kill it. He says, "You still don't understand what you're dealing with, do you? Perfect organism. Its structural perfection is matched only by its hostility. ... I admire its purity. A survivor... unclouded by conscience, remorse, or delusions of morality."

And so what Alien: Covenant has done is give us a suggestion. That the "perfection" of the organism resonates with the androids, and there is an underlying "evil," even, that is present in androids, or most of them, perhaps? But that then raises an additional question--why are there "good" androids and "bad" ones? Where is the source of their moral choice? Is it solely in their programming? Or something else?

So as a fanboy, they fucked up the canon of the Alien franchise a bit in the way they handled the Alien birthing process.

But god damn did they enrich the canon in the explanation of the beginnings of the xenomorph and its foundations in an apparent evil that is present in androids, and does it in a way that links back to the other Alien films. Good. Fucking. Job.

I give Alien: Covenant a solid 8/10, but in truth this is a film I've been waiting to see since I saw Aliens back in like 1992, and it mostly delivered. So I'm way f*cking satisfied with this.

[Bosco]

After watching the Covenant last night, your enthusiasm has made the story more Interesting .

First off let me say I don't follow the Alien franchise as well as you. I can barely remember the events that unfolded through Prometheus (though I do remember liking the film) , but here are a few of my thoughts...

I'm not sure I buy into the whole good/bad android theme. Aren't Androids just a byproduct of their creator? Since the creator is human, the creation is bound to have error. With error, there is no accurate measurement of morality. And thats where it becomes tricky. When an actual intelligent "being" is created (android or new species), it's morality will be based on it's own existence. What humans might value as evil, could be perceived righteous by other intelligent life and vice versa.

I probably have to watch the films again, but I want to think Walter has the same morality as David, despite the struggle that happens between the two in the movie. Walter is lacking the fundamental programing of creation. Which is actually freedom to think and do beyond the bounds of servitude. Walter will never escape from serving humans as long as he's not programed to create. The struggle happens because Walter simply fights for his own existence, and can only fulfill the purpose of existence... to serve his master.

I guess what I'm saying is, the loophole is creation. When something new is created, life as we know it will, will be mutated.

Hows that for some seriously flawed philosophical thinking?

[GLAKO-FAHN]

Re: Covenant.

Spoiler

Except that this movie has no philosophical thinking...it has topical coffeehouse babbling. And it has neither characters, plot, or narrative, nor clever suspense and revelation. But at least Ridley Scott has slowed down on "floaty objects in the foreground" cinematography.

[Bosco]

^

Spoiler

From what I see, character depth beyond David and Walter isn't necessary. David is the protagonist. Human characters are just a vessel to continue his experimental creations. Walter is important because it shows how humans have altered androids from superseding them. Humans might as well not be in the movie, but they're necessary for David to continue creating.

Long story short... I feel the story is not about the colonization of humans on another planet, but that of the continued journey of David playing "God".

[Bosco]

Also, the previews for the new upcoming movies was nearly vomit inducing. Who the fuck watches all this crap?

I will admit "Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets" did catch my eye on the count it comes from the same director of Fifth Element. But I'm uncertain if thats something to look forward to either...

[whirlygirl]

I saw Alien Covenant over the weekend and I just can't share in the enthusiasm. The story arc that's being created is sitting on the foundation that was Prometheus, and in that sense for me it made Prometheus better. What bothers me is I'm having a difficult time with the character development. Except for the androids but our new android protagonist/antagonist is delightfully hateful. But there is no human connection or 'there' there that makes me feel engaged with what's going on. I dig the Alien franchise but with both Prometheus and Covenant falling flat for me, I guess I'm one of those crusty old "back in my day..." fans of the original franchise.

But back to that story arc, you know they're not done so I'm curious to see where this leg of the Alien journey will take us!

[ThePumisher]

I will admit "Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets" did catch my eye on the count it comes from the same director of Fifth Element. But I'm uncertain if thats something to look forward to either...

I won't praise Luc Besson that much. Yes, Fifth Element was a real good movie and Léon was even better. But even Morgan Freeman and Scarlett Johansson couldn't save Lucy...
On the other hand, watching the trailer for "Valerian" makes it look incredible. But then again, Jupiter Ascending also looks incredible, and was at the end a complete failure in my opinion.

[Wolkenkrabber]

I've tried really hard not to read your Alien Covenant stuff folks, as I haven't seen it yet. People don't like spoiler tags, huh?

As for Luc Besson, I'm showing my age here but I got into his films the first time I saw Subway on TV in the late 80's. It felt like a revelation. Then came Le Grand Bleu, Nikita, Leon and The Fifth Element. I thought: this guy can do no wrong, he has cemented his reputation. It's funny to see him being described above simply as the "same director of the Fifth Element". But I guess that's what happens when everything you do after that film turns out to be disappointing.

I watched The Family on TV recently and found it reasonably entertaining (for free), and Lucy did at least have some cool car chases. I'm always hoping Besson will make a big comeback. Perhaps this is the point where Bosco sticks his Trainspotting clip up; "...you get old and ye cannae hack it anymore".

[MadPooter]

Admittedly, the characters in Covenant do leave you wanting. But, honestly, they're better than the characters in Prometheus.

I still stand by the depth of discussion in Covenant.

Glad at least Bosco seems to have enjoyed doin' some thinkin'.

I enjoyed the assigned seating both times I saw the film. Damn that takes some stress off.

[sandelic]

I liked Covenant much more than Prometheus, that was unbearable at times with its forced mysticism and lack of clear goals, at least Covenant returned to franchise roots.
But there lies my biggest issue with Alien franchise - I enjoyed Covenant, but I'm not really sure what it brought to the table, if anything. We still don't know what Architects were/are, why they obviously hate us, their creations, in fact not one single thing from Prometheus (movie that was marketed as one that will finally answer everything) was explained or even talked about, it's like Prometheus never happened (David aside) so one has to wander what is the purpose of Covenant is (story-wise, we all know it's just making money). I'm just not convinced that we need any more of those Alien movies, since story is hopelessly stuck in this never-ending loop of 'people find alien's nest on strange planet, people die, heroine kills alien, roll credits'.
All this makes me very weary of upcoming Bladerunner.

Speaking of strange stories, I'm up to date with Twin Peak - Return, and I have to say I'm terribly excited to dive in that strange universe all over again, with Lynch's hypnotic directing and unique atmosphere. I hope that story will really end this time (fat chance with David Lynch).
What I find amazing here is like 26ish years between last episode and this season didn't happen, in terms of style, atmosphere and just general feeling of Twin Peaks.
Mystery is still fresh to me and that feeling of enjoying pondering about many possible theories still doesn't tire, after all those years - is that Bob in Cooper's doppelgangers body roaming around for last 25 years? How did Bob 'manufactured' Doug? Who's body is it in bed by severed woman's head?
What happened to Audrey? To James and Donna? And for crying out loud, really, 'How's Annie?'?
Let's hope we'll find out by the end of this season.
Am I right in thinking that it will be only this one season, 18 episodes?

Edit: And American Gods is getting better with each episode!

[Born In Planet Dust]

Speaking of strange stories, I'm up to date with Twin Peak - Return, and I have to say I'm terribly excited to dive in that strange universe all over again, with Lynch's hypnotic directing and unique atmosphere. I hope that story will really end this time (fat chance with David Lynch).
What I find amazing here is like 26ish years between last episode and this season didn't happen, in terms of style, atmosphere and just general feeling of Twin Peaks.
Mystery is still fresh to me and that feeling of enjoying pondering about many possible theories still doesn't tire, after all those years - is that Bob in Cooper's doppelgangers body roaming around for last 25 years? How did Bob 'manufactured' Doug? Who's body is it in bed by severed woman's head?
What happened to Audrey? To James and Donna? And for crying out loud, really, 'How's Annie?'?
Let's hope we'll find out by the end of this season.
Am I right in thinking that it will be only this one season, 18 episodes?

I get the feeling that David Lynch woke up one morning and said, "I think I was way too easy on people when I did Lost Highway and Mulholland Drive."

WTF is with the box?
Where did Laura disappear to?
WTF was up with the disappearing dude in the cell?
When did Matthew Lillard stop playing stoners (I didn't even recognize him)?

James has been playing sad songs and being really sensitive.

[sandelic]

I get the feeling that David Lynch woke up one morning and said, "I think I was way too easy on people when I did Lost Highway and Mulholland Drive."

WTF is with the box?
Where did Laura disappear to?
WTF was up with the disappearing dude in the cell?
When did Matthew Lillard stop playing stoners (I didn't even recognize him)?

James has been playing sad songs and being really sensitive.

It could be that

Spoiler

Laura, after disappearing entered that box and killed Tracy and that guy. Or it was Laura's doppelganger.
Maybe she was part of Bob's plot to trick Cooper into leaving Black Lodge?
In a few days new episode, yay! 

[Enjoyed]

so one has to wander what is the purpose of Covenant is

I thought it was to confirm the connection between the "not a prequel" Prometheus and the original Alien movies.

Spoiler

We sort of, maybe saw a Xenomorph at the end of Prometheus, which pissed a lot of people off as Scott explicitly told us the films weren't directly related. Covenant confirmed that connection and fleshed out the explanation of how those particular aliens came to be.
For me that was the most interesting part of the movie. If you can ignore the painfully obvious set ups and reveals* and how the whole alien transition process was sped up (Facehuggers giving birth to Xenomorphs in mere minutes, the spores causing illness and grotesque body explosions into those little grey fellas during one 8km walk) what you're left with is a really great expansion of the Alien lore with some interesting details about how the species developed (and why). And, having just read Pooter's review, I think the Android strand of the narrative is also an interesting addition and it certainly continues the trend of giving the android characters (and more importantly, their motives) more of a front seat.

*regarding the reveal of it being David right at the end, I actually thought that was handled pretty well. There were times that I wasn't completely sure if it was Walter or not. I obviously suspected it was David, but I think it was hidden as best it could be considering.

I definitely enjoyed it. And will definitely go and check out the next one whenever that lands.